Greetings,


I am a new member, I am of the Kemetic faith, formerly a Buddhist for many years. I would like to discuss Samuel I as it pertains to the relationship between Saul and David.

Here is a short recap:


13:13 Samuel tells Saul that "Thou hast done foolishly, thou hast not kept the commandment of the Lord thy G-d which he commanded thee: for now would the Lord have established thy kingdom upon Israel forever."

13:14 "But now thy kingdom shall not continue. . ." (Saul's first disobeyance.)
This is the point where the Lord tells Samuel that He "seeks a man after His own heart." Then Samuel goes in search of David and annoints him King of Israel.

Samuel I, chapter 15, Samuel tells Saul to kill all of the Amalekites as the Lord instructed. Saul capture King Agag and lets he and the best of his animals live. Then Samuel comes and kills King Agag and admonishes Saul. (Saul's second disobeyance.)

15:10- "Then came the word of the Lord to Samuel, saying 15:11 It repenteth me that I have set up Saul to be king; for he is turned back from following Me, and hath not performed My commandments." (How is it that the Lord repents what He has commanded?)

16:21 David goes to Saul. 17:50 David kills Goliath.

18:11 Saul cast a javelin at David and misses. "I will smite David even to the wall with it. And David avoided out of his presence twice."

8:25--Saul sends David to smite the Philistines for the hand of his daughter believing that David will be killed. (Again Saul tries to have David killed via the Philistines).

18:29 David returns and Saul is more afraid of David.

19:11-Saul sends messengers to kill David. (Another plot to kill David.)

20:31 Saul tells Jonathan to go get David so he can kill him. (Another plot to kill David.)

Chapter 21--David goes to Nob to the priest Ahimelech for refuge. They give him bread and a sword.

22:17-19 Saul goes to Nob and kills Ahimelech, the priests of the Lord, women, children, babies and all the animals. (Saul murdered priests of the Lord.)

Chpater 25 - Samuel dies.

28:8 - Saul seeks the witch to conjure the ghost of Samuel. (It is a sin to seek a witch in Hebrew law.)

28:16 "Then said Samuel, Wherefore then dost thou ask of me, seeing the Lord is departed from thee, and is become thine enemy?"
Isn't it a sin to support or esteem Saul after G-d has said that Saul is His enemy? Yet according to one Jewish person that I asked, Saul is esteemed by the Jews.

IMHO, Saul may have started out as a good man with good intentions, however, he became corrupt and evil.

My questions are in BLUE if anyone can shed light on this, I would appreciate it. Christian and/or Jewish interpretation would be great.

I am looking for the reference in Torah on this as I believe the King James Bible has a mistranslation with the word "repenteth", should it not have translated to "regret"?



Thanks to anyone who cares to comment. I have other questions on this book for later.

Fortuna

1Sam 15v10-11: Then came the word of the LORD unto Samuel, saying,
It repenteth me that I have set up Saul to be king: for he is turned back from following me, and hath not performed my commandments. And it grieved Samuel; and he cried unto the LORD all night.
1Sam 15v29: And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent.

How can God both repent and not repent? The answer is that His "repentance" (meaning change of mind) refers to His actions, His non repentance to His Character. That is, He seemsto outside observers to change His mind and His resulting action precisely because-as the all righteous God-He does not change His mind regarding the character of sin and it's consequences.
Well that' the best I can do but there are better people out there than me at explaining the bible.

Also it was the peoples insistance that they had a human king, God gave them their desires and let them have their way.

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Hi Paul,


Thank you for your interpretation. I believe you expressed it very well and have helped my understanding of this passage.

Question - How do you see Saul in relation to his actions toward David and G-d?

Question- Do believe it a sin to revere Saul who became the enemy of G-d?

Thank you so much for your valuable reply.

Fortuna

__________________
The opinions expressed in my post are only my humble opinions. I expressly request that none of my opinions be taken personally or taken offense to as it is not in my nature to intentionally cause hurt. I am only human and I make mistakes, so please remember this when reading some of my more passionate or lengthy posts. --Fortuna

Well David still revered Him as the Lords anointed even though He had fallen, and would not strike him so neither will I. He recieved the anointing of the Lord, which to me Is a type of new testament salvation:
1Jn 2v27: But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
Just as when a Christian is born again, he may fall into sin and become decieved, he is never the less saved. And though a brother may have to go against that person and rebuke him openly He is still a brother.
Of course the anointing (the Holy Spirit) can teach people who listen to His voice and submit to His will. His voice is discerened through the reading of the scriptures (whereby he quickens certain messages to our hearts)not by mystical practices.

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The original Hebrew word used is ~xn, pronounced nacham, or naw-kham. It means to be sorry; comfort and/or ease oneself; to have compassion; regret.

<edit>
Just also wanted to add that it also means to repent. The word "repenteth" in the Hebrew is ~xn.

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[belief is NOT the same as TRUTH]

Hi Rhem

Thank you for the Hebrew translation. This still leaves me back where I started as I believe there is the nuance of a major difference.

However, this may be the only way this word translates effectively from Hebrew. I do think it should be written differently, but that is just me being picky.

Hi Paul,

You do not wish to strike Saul, however, I do not revere him as G-d considers Saul an enemy. Good for David for proving that he was of G-d's heart and a compassionate man. He obviously was the better man.

I think it is quite likely, regardless of my disdain for Saul, that he must have had mental problems, but they might have been brought on by a brain tumor or a mental illness. Perhaps this was G-d's punishment for He could see into his heart and knew Saul would try to murder David and disobey Him.

But, how could this be part of G-d's plan when he was sorry to have made Saul king? Other forces appear to be at work here.:confused:

Anyway, thank you both for your opinions and insight. You have both helped to understand a little better. I will keep studying the bible as usual.

Thanks again !! Fortuna

__________________
The opinions expressed in my post are only my humble opinions. I expressly request that none of my opinions be taken personally or taken offense to as it is not in my nature to intentionally cause hurt. I am only human and I make mistakes, so please remember this when reading some of my more passionate or lengthy posts. --Fortuna

Youre welcome and i agree with you about translation. IMHO, i believe it's more beneficial to have the "more" literal translation. Just keep in mind the KJV bible translated it's source document with the purpose of making it "easy reading" for it's readers. A lot of verses are translated more poetically and give it's reader a better visualization.

Personally, i use the NASB bible. Supposedly, it's the most literal translation. I say supposedly because in a few verses, the original words still arent being used.

i recommend learning how to use the concordance from this site:
http://bible.crosswalk.com/

It shows you the original translated words and their literal and metaphorical definition. You can actually read verses and click on each word to find these definitions.

__________________
[belief is NOT the same as TRUTH]

Hi Rhem,
Thanks for the link. This is a very good site for my research.

Thank you again!

Fortuna

__________________
The opinions expressed in my post are only my humble opinions. I expressly request that none of my opinions be taken personally or taken offense to as it is not in my nature to intentionally cause hurt. I am only human and I make mistakes, so please remember this when reading some of my more passionate or lengthy posts. --Fortuna