Hotel-type heaven? John 14:2-4

John Harris · #1 (**permalink**) 21st August 2007, 05:44 PM

John 14 is pivotal, since the Christian belief in a hotel-style heaven is based on it.

Quote:

1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. 2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know. 5 Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way? 6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. 7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him. 8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. 9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? 10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. 11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.

12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. 20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. 21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. 22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. 27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I. 29 And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe. 30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me. 31 But that the world may know that I love the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Arise, let us go hence.

In verse 4, why did Jesus say, "whither I go ye know, and the way ye know" when the disciples clearly did not know? Could it be his way of saying "Think about it"?

When they asked for an explanation, why did Jesus change the subject and talk about "seeing the Father"? Is seeing the Father equivalent to being in heaven? Does verse 20 refer to the Divine Unity? Is this being in heaven?

Does verse 23 say that heaven will come to the disciple, rather than the disciple going to heaven?

Does verse 26 indicate that there is another meaning to his words?

Does verse 30 refer to the crucifixion?

vivamis123 · #2 (**permalink**) 21st August 2007, 06:39 PM

In verse 4, why did Jesus say, "whither I go ye know, and the way ye know" when the disciples clearly did not know? Could it be his way of saying "Think about it"?

It could be meant as think about it, it could also be that Jesus assumed they knew. Maybe they did know, but were not aware they knew. This reminds me of people that ask questions yet knowing the answer. I guess some people lack faith in their knowing until it is validated. (I can relate to that!)

When they asked for an explanation, why did Jesus change the subject and talk about "seeing the Father"? Is seeing the Father equivalent to being in heaven? Does verse 20 refer to the Divine Unity? Is this being in heaven?

1) Jesus did not really change the subject. That was his answer: 6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. Christ is the oneness of the father with the son. It is our realization of being the I am, the creator and the witness.
2)Yes, because this awareness sets you free from suffering.
3) Yes, I believe there is no God & Me & You, we are all one.
4) When awareness disappears as individuals, all false hood is rid and what is left is Truth.

Does verse 23 say that heaven will come to the disciple, rather than the disciple going to heaven?
Yes, I see it that way. Heaven can be experienced here on earth, by knowing who (what) we truly are.

Does verse 26 indicate that there is another meaning to his words?
No, I believe once the seed is planted, it will grow. The holy spirit is our very experience and awareness.

Does verse 30 refer to the crucifixion?

Only if Jesus the person went away (the belief) would the truth be revealed to us: In Christ we are One (come again unto you).

John Harris · #3 (**permalink**) 21st August 2007, 09:05 PM

I have been thinking that there is nothing of an individual that lives on after death, but that one's happiness, salvation, and immortality lie in the immortality of God. Is this a big let-down or what??

You said:

Quote:

Christ is the oneness of the father with the son. It is our realization of being the I am, the creator and the witness.

What do you mean by the word "witness"? Where does it come from?

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode