InterfaithForums

Welcome to the InterfaithForums forums.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions, articles and access our other FREE features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact support.

Arcade Support Us FAQ Calendar vBRadio Quiz
Go Back   InterfaithForums > Debate Forum > Religious Debate
Home Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Religious Debate Debate religions and religious topics.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 03:09 PM
evangelicalhumanist's Avatar
Seeking intelligent life
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 2,627
Coins: 234,313.74
Bank: 5,240,660.33
Total Coins: 5,474,974.07
Donate
Karma:1553
evangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant futureevangelicalhumanist has a brilliant future



Esoteric Christianity

Somebody recently told me that “esoteric Christianity” is the path they follow. This raised some questions in my mind. But first, let’s define esoteric (from the Houghton Mifflin Canadian Dictionary):
  1. Intended for or understood by only a small group. To the esoteric Hellenic mystery cults, Christianity opposed an exoteric religion.
  2. Difficult to understand; abstruse.
  3. Not publicly disclosed; confidential.
I suspect that the second meaning (difficult to understand) is not the intended definition of esoteric in this case, and that therefore we are talking about a Christianity that is secret or meant for only a few initiates.

My question is two-fold:
Could it be possible that the God of any Christian religion has ordain that only a very few are able or entitled to understand the meaning of human life and the human relationship to God? Or, if this seems unlikely to believers;

Could it be possible that this is just another way for a “select (by themselves) few” to claim that they are beyond (or apart, or above, or better than) the vast majority of people by virtue of having special knowledge, knowledge which it is – by definition of esoteric – impossible to establish that they have, or that even exists?
__________________
evangelicalhumanist: Greek "eu"=good and "angelos"=messenger. Spreading the good news of Humanism.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 03:20 PM
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 3,028
Coins: 14,943,824.09
Bank: 0.00
Total Coins: 14,943,824.09
Donate
Karma:296
vivamis123 is a jewel in the roughvivamis123 is a jewel in the roughvivamis123 is a jewel in the rough



E.H. I think it is only fair to bring in another definition of esoteric, since I find the Houghton Mifflin Canadian Dictionary to be bias.
Here from wikipedia:

Esoteric knowledge is that which is specialized or advanced in nature, available only to a narrow circle of "enlightened", "initiated", or highly educated people.[2] Items pertaining to esotericism may be known as esoterica.[3] Some interpretations of esotericism are very broad and include even unconventional and non-scientific belief systems, typically as contrasted with the "scientific" or "traditional religious" beliefs of the society without or "at large".
__________________
May your awareness be perfection
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 04:34 PM
Banned
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 1,072
Coins: 59,300.06
Bank: 0.00
Total Coins: 59,300.06
Donate
Karma:103
Nick_A will become famous soon enoughNick_A will become famous soon enough

Here is a good overview of Esoteric Christianity.

http://www.hermes-press.com/Perennia...ristianity.htm

"Esoteric" means inner in contrast to "exoteric" Christianity which means outer. Exoteric Christianity is collective societal man made conceptions while esoteric Christianity is verification of conscious human evolution through self knowledge

Quote:
Could it be possible that the God of any Christian religion has ordain that only a very few are able or entitled to understand the meaning of human life and the human relationship to God? Or, if this seems unlikely to believers;

The human condition of Man on earth is characterized as being dominated by his lower physical parts or the physical body. That being the case, the collective results of humanity are the same as with other forms of organic life.

If all acorns grew to become oaks, life on earth would become so out of balance that everything would die. consequently, most acorns just feed the earth through decay or serve as food for creatures on the earth. The living inner kernel of life of the acorn never breaks the shell of the husk.

What else could be expected from ignorance of our higher parts? Human results will become the results of lower parts or what constitutes collective organic life on earth The universe is not politically correct but just logical.

Quote:
Could it be possible that this is just another way for a “select (by themselves) few” to claim that they are beyond (or apart, or above, or better than) the vast majority of people by virtue of having special knowledge, knowledge which it is – by definition of esoteric – impossible to establish that they have, or that even exists?

This seems unfair at first glance but in fact the potency of this inner knowledge, its ability to result in conscious transformation remains because it is rejected by the masses. An individual can then use what is rejected. A certain amount of humanity becomes as you imply entitled because of rejection. A quality of higher emotional intensity unlike intensity that comes from negative emotion that occurs because of being open to reality attracts conscious help from above to help the healthy seed of the soul remain on the path. Most prefer rose colored glasses and the imagination they produce to justify the absurd and retain life as it is.

This minority of people that sense the meaning and purpose of human life beyond the domain of the earth are "select" IMO. They sense themselves within Plato's cave and strive to come out. To some this is elitist and to me it is normal. The abnormal for me is the casual acceptance of cave life and the results on earth it produces like genocides.

Esoteric Christianity is to Christianity as Sufism is to Islam. Some see these qualitative divisions as select and elitist but I see them as normal and necessary for both individual and collective human conscious evolution..
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 05:32 PM
arthra's Avatar
Super Moderator
 

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Sunny Southern California
Posts: 2,084
Coins: 157,093.58
Bank: 254,488.41
Total Coins: 411,581.99
Donate
Karma:447
arthra is just really nicearthra is just really nicearthra is just really nicearthra is just really nicearthra is just really nice
Send a message via Yahoo to arthra

"...available only to a narrow circle of "enlightened", "initiated", or highly educated people."

"Esoteric" means inner in contrast to "exoteric" Christianity

Intended for or understood by only a small group. To the esoteric Hellenic mystery cults, Christianity opposed an exoteric religion.
Difficult to understand; abstruse.
Not publicly disclosed; confidential.

...............................

Some years ago I hosted a discussion group on Gnosticism.. I would think it would qualify under the above definitions..

While normally I wouldn't comment of Christianity as a religion..in a historical sense I suspect that one of the reasons Gnosticism failed socially to survive was due to the characteristic of being exclusive and elitist as opposed to the "universal" or catholic..variety of Christianity. Propably the better aspect of the Church in the Middle ages was that it did provide a kind of egalitarianism ... in it's day where a commoner good rise through the ranks but of course Bishoprics were often for sale and so on. At least that's what i recall from my history classes a long time ago...

- Art
__________________
"it benefits us to be thoughtful, not of the glory of our minds, but rather, above all else, of the glory of God."
- Johannes Kepler
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 05:38 PM
Banned
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 1,072
Coins: 59,300.06
Bank: 0.00
Total Coins: 59,300.06
Donate
Karma:103
Nick_A will become famous soon enoughNick_A will become famous soon enough

I feel obligated here to write a warning even though I'm sure it will promote some growls.

In recent times the expression "esoteric Christianity" is being adopted by many including those defining themselves within the Interfaith movement.

Just because people use a phrase like Esoteric Christianity does not mean that they understand it or its acknowledgement of the human condition and the hold of imagination on our psych.

That being said, beware of anything like this:

http://www.radiant-light.org/

A person must make the cold hard choice if they need truth or would prefer fantasy. It is a serious choice. Carrying our cross means to suffer "ourselves." We must suffer becoming aware of the reality of our inner condition before beginning to become free from it. It is real suffering. A person must seriously decide if the truth is so important that they are willing to suffer for it.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 06:27 PM
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 3,028
Coins: 14,943,824.09
Bank: 0.00
Total Coins: 14,943,824.09
Donate
Karma:296
vivamis123 is a jewel in the roughvivamis123 is a jewel in the roughvivamis123 is a jewel in the rough



Could it be possible that the God of any Christian religion has ordain that only a very few are able or entitled to understand the meaning of human life and the human relationship to God?

No.
Just as science is available to anyone that truly wants to understand the science of science : ) esoteric is available to all. As science takes it's knowledge from the physical appearance of things, esoteric seeks spiritual reason and cause.

Could it be possible that this is just another way for a “select (by themselves) few” to claim that they are beyond (or apart, or above, or better than) the vast majority of people by virtue of having special knowledge, knowledge which it is – by definition of esoteric – impossible to establish that they have, or that even exists?

I don't know if it is possible that some could see themselves above/beyond others, after attaining esoteric knowledge, but in my opinion they are wrong. Is a scientist with his knowledge above others? Is a Doctor with his knowledge above others? I think that is a personal issue and not an issue of knowledge. Knowledge itself has no other value, then the one we give it.
__________________
May your awareness be perfection
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 25th October 2007, 10:50 PM
aged hippy's Avatar
Alchemist
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Wandering in a pathless land
Posts: 1,177
Coins: 169,370.04
Bank: 7,646.06
Total Coins: 177,016.10
Donate
Karma:516
aged hippy is a glorious beacon of lightaged hippy is a glorious beacon of lightaged hippy is a glorious beacon of lightaged hippy is a glorious beacon of lightaged hippy is a glorious beacon of lightaged hippy is a glorious beacon of light


Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelicalhumanist
Could it be possible that the God of any Christian religion has ordain that only a very few are able or entitled to understand the meaning of human life and the human relationship to God?
No - definitely not, in my opinion.
I think that if the god of any religion set things up in such a way, then it would not be a god worthy of worship - at least, not by beings which are capable of thought.


Quote:
Could it be possible that this is just another way for a “select (by themselves) few” to claim that they are beyond (or apart, or above, or better than) the vast majority of people by virtue of having special knowledge, knowledge which it is – by definition of esoteric – impossible to establish that they have, or that even exists?
I think that this is indeed the case.
It seems to me that many imagine that they are in possession of 'select' knowledge and hint to other people that they are, in order to be seen as somehow knowledgeable or enlightened in such matters.
Or maybe they merely pretend to being in the possession of such knowledge in order to gain some sort of respect, worship, or (more likely) adoration from other people.


On the other hand (beside four fingers and a thumb) - i do think that much of the message of Jesus (and other bearers of similar information) was deliberately hidden, simply because it's no good trying to explain the workings of momentum, the conservation of energy, and the relationship between pain and the nervous system to a child - even though the child is quite able to understand that if it hits it's thumb again with a hammer the result will once more be pain.

In other words (possibly more lucid) - i think that the 'inner meanings' were deliberately veiled over, as it were, because a person cannot grasp something which is beyond their comprehension, but as their ability to understand increases, they will be able to peel away the layers of veils, until - eventually - the real message is seen and fully comprehended.
This process, of course, involves discarding one's own cherished beliefs and opinions.... not an easy task for the ego to accomplish.


Peace, Love, & Light
__________________
"An object is perceived, or not perceived, according as the mind is, or is not, tinged with the colour of the object. "
Patanjali - Sutra 4:17
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Coins Per Thread View: 1.00
Coins Per Thread: 15.00
Coins Per Reply: 5.00




All times are GMT. The time now is 06:31 AM.


Copyright ©, 2005-2008 Interfaithforums.com. All Rights Reserved

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.1.0