http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/....aspx?id=19306


An interesting subject for debate, I think.

I abhor the message of the Prosperity "Gospel" types; as an outsider -- that is a non-Christain -- I think they pervert Christianity in a particularly offensive way.

But I rather agree with the author of the article, the State shouldn;t get involved in theological squabbles.

So....what is your take on this?

"Be seeing you..."

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Grassaf, Eolas

I remember the general craziness with the Baker scandal back in the '80's. It shook up alot of people but it didn't stop TV preachers and it didn't serve as a warning to the preacher who followed. There has been quite a few scandals in the last two years that didn't have as much fan fare.

But should the state get involved? Yes, they are already involved. The state determines who gets tax exempt status, rules over political speech with church and now faith based charities. But should congress be investigating a particular minister? No, it's a waste of my tax dollars when other agencies have the authority to investigate and take legal action.

Consider this, it's been a highly religious charged administration and the race for presidential elections is already underway. This Senate investigate is just a typical time wasting feel good stunt. It's really telling that an Iowa senator is spearheading it.

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To breathe each breath is a prayer of thanks to Gaia.

Hi Eolas - I'm not quite sure if we're talking about the money a church/program takes in, or the churches that teach abundance/prosperity. Or maybe you mean both.

I can see the issue from both sides, so I'm torn on it. I think the principle behind abundance living is a positive one (our thoughts create our reality, and while there is nothing holy about being wealthy, there is nothing holy about being poor either). That being said, the new high school that was built a couple years ago in our school district (which is very nice) is dwarfed by the Baptist church across the street. The church is 3 stories high, has 4 large wings, a running track, Starbucks, cyber cafe, etc. - It's probably as big as a major shopping mall in square footage. It still gets to me.....

Let everyone have what they desire. It's all good : )

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May your awareness be perfection

A good distiinction. I think he means both, since the ministers that are making a killing are the ones that seem to preach this "YHWH loves the rich man more than the poor man," "Believe and YHWH will make you wealthy," message.

I actually think that it might not be a bad idea if the authorities wanted to limit the amount any religious corporation could own/ take-in. Espeically in those cases where there is an inverse relationship between the amount raised and the amount of charity -- real charity, not building/playing for ever-larger church buildings -- engaged in.


But high schools are for teenagers and teacher, and no one really likes teenagers or teachers, after all.

"Be seeing you..."

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Grassaf, Eolas

I agree that the 'prosperity gospel' is a repulsive one.
Jesus actually says not to worry about the things you need: that God already knows we NEED these things, but to seek first the kingdom of God, and these things will be added unto us. (my paraphrase Matt 6)
He was speaking about things we NEED, not wealth that we hoard, which we have taken by decieving others. (or even taking it honestly, for that matter)
When Jesus said he was here so we could have life and have it more abundantly, I take that to me the quality of life and love, NOT furs and cars and gobs of gross make up.

Frankly, I think it's incredibly interesting that a Republican senator is leading the way in the investigation of some of the most powerful members of the religious right. I am a bleeding-heart liberal and proud of it, but I give credit where credit is due: Charles Grassley is a very courageous politician to take on the most powerful wing of his party.

These so-called prosperity preachers are despicable, bilking the poor out of their last dollar with the promise that by "sowing their seed", God will reward them with a financial windfall. A special rung of hell is reserved for these charlatans who take from the poor, old, mentally ill, and desperate among us in order to feather their own nests.

The government should do all that they legally can to protect those in our society who are least able to protect themselves. It is high time these cockroaches dressed up as holy men and women get the bright light of the law shined on them.

So far, we have almost all of the responses to this thread expressing a real dislike for the prosperity gospel. I'm wondering why we tend to feel that it's wrong for religious institutions to make alot of money........ Anyone know? Although I like what justifyothers said about not worrying about our needs/material desires, how many of us actually can say we follow that guidance?

Just to play the other side for a minute: Is it possible that they are practicing a very spiritual principle? That our thoughts do indeed create our experience, and that God wants us to have life abundantly? If people can go from practicing outer wealth to later including inner wealth, is it necessarly a bad thing?

As we know, it is not money but the LOVE of money that is the root of all evil, so I don't think that wealth in itself is wicked. However, the subject of this thread is "Prosperity Gospel", more specifically the kind that is practiced by the six preachers subpoenaed by the Senate to hand over their financial records.

These people are televangelists who are making MILLIONS of dollars off the backs of the poor, elderly, desperate, and mentally ill. Turn on TBN and watch 5 minutes of their ""Praise-a-thon", going on right now. In a scroll at the bottom of the screen, they are directing viewers to "give $70, $700, or $7,000 as a special offering to God and he will bless you with an inheritance. 'I will be an enemy to your enemies'".

This is absolutely pornographic to me.

I notice they use the psychologically magical number "7", -- "70", "700", "7000".... i take it 7 dollars wouldn't get his attention....?

They seem to have brought god down to their level.


Peace, Love, & Light

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"An object is perceived, or not perceived, according as the mind is, or is not, tinged with the colour of the object. "
Patanjali - Sutra 4:17