Evidence?

[Storm2008]

Something I hear frequently from non-believers is that they would believe in God if there were any evidence. I have two issues with this statement.

1) There is some - admittedly very weak - evidence: the widespread reports of personal experiences with God. Now, I can see why this is unconvincing, but it is evidence. Weak, yes, but evidence nonetheless, which is more than can be said for the argument that there is no God. With that nit picked....

2) What evidence of God's existence could there be? You say that evidence would convince you, but what would qualify?

Please note, I am asking about God's existence only, not assuming that God wants us to believe/ worship. I don't believe that God cares one way or another what we believe, so those arguments - while valid when appropriate - are not relevant to this particular conversation.

[wwwdlhow27]

Quite right.
In my humble opinion, God (The Creator) created everything that is, and will continue to do so thoughout eternity, wether is an "US" or not. We, along with all creation, are One with God because there was nothing else to create from except God. If any look for evidence, look in the mirror, look inside, look at anything, everything. If one cannot find evidence in Creation itself, you're not ready to see it. You're over-thinking it. It's so obvious you refuse except it's simplicity and intricacy. God doesn't need an audience, God doesn't need our adoration or love. God IS Unconditional Love, and that simply means God loves everyone equaly with no expectation of anything in return. Try it, you'll like it!

[aged hippy]

Originally Posted by wwwdlhow27

God doesn't need an audience, God doesn't need our adoration or love. God IS Unconditional Love, and that simply means God loves everyone equaly with no expectation of anything in return. Try it, you'll like it!

Right.

A god which creates an entire species with the intention of said species 'worshipping' or "adoring" or being 'devoted' to him/her/it is a god which is less than its creation, in my opinion.


Peace, Love, & Light

[metis]

Originally Posted by Storm2008

1) There is some - admittedly very weak - evidence: the widespread reports of personal experiences with God. Now, I can see why this is unconvincing, but it is evidence. Weak, yes, but evidence nonetheless, which is more than can be said for the argument that there is no God. With that nit picked....

What may be evidence to one person may not be to another. If someone says that he/she has enough evidence to believe in a deity, who am I to tell them they're wrong? Maybe it is I that has been missing something.

2) What evidence of God's existence could there be? You say that evidence would convince you, but what would qualify?

It would have to be something for me that would be clearly observable using the senses that we have, and also be objectively verifiable in some way. IOW, the scientific method should be applied.

[arthra]

Being partial to history I see a gradual developement and advancement of humanity over the ages and religion has been a catalyst in that advancement in my view.. Also if you examine what we know about the great teachers and Prophets you can I believe appreciate what some call the Hand of God in it.

- Art

[Amergin]

Originally Posted by Storm2008

Something I hear frequently from non-believers is that they would believe in God if there were any evidence. I have two issues with this statement.

1) There is some - admittedly very weak - evidence: the widespread reports of personal experiences with God. Now, I can see why this is unconvincing, but it is evidence. Weak, yes, but evidence nonetheless, which is more than can be said for the argument that there is no God. With that nit picked....

With a very loose definition of evidence, there is equally credible "evidence" of psychokinesis, clairvoyance, Bigfoot, Nessie, and Space Aliens sticking rods up the asses of Kansas rednecks. The proper term for your evidence is "hearsay". People who have spoken to God have the same credibility as those reporting being abducted by UFO's and taken to Alpha Centauri. Real evidence has to be "evident" to all who see or hear it.

Originally Posted by Storm2008

2) What evidence of God's existence could there be? You say that evidence would convince you, but what would qualify?

Good question. Credible evidence would be some action such as simultaneous communication of the same message to each and every human on Earth. Why would a God exist but hide from almost all humans except a few eccentrics whom he takes behind the barn and whispers in their ears. What has God got to hide? Perhaps it is his non-existence? Why would God want to make it look like he doesn't exist?

Originally Posted by Storm2008

Please note, I am asking about God's existence only, not assuming that God wants us to believe/ worship. I don't believe that God cares one way or another what we believe, so those arguments - while valid when appropriate - are not relevant to this particular conversation.

First of all, if God exists, why does he wish to hide from us? There is strong evidence that if God exists, he does not wish us to worship him or believe in him. He has gone to great work to make it look like he doesn't exist. I wish there were a kind and good God, but wishing doesn't make things happen. I wish I were a young handsome billionaire married to Catherine Zeta-Jones. But I am a near elderly big clumsy Scotsman who buys clothing at a Big Men's Store.

I don't know if there is a God or not because there is no evidence in my opinion. That does not mean that God does not exist because none of us can know that.

Amergin

[Storm2008]

Originally Posted by Amergin

Good question. Credible evidence would be some action such as simultaneous communication of the same message to each and every human on Earth.

That would be excellent evidence that GOd cares what we think, but that's not the question.

Why would a God exist but hide from almost all humans except a few eccentrics whom he takes behind the barn and whispers in their ears. What has God got to hide? Perhaps it is his non-existence? Why would God want to make it look like he doesn't exist?

I don't think God hides. I think we're just still developing the ability to perceive God. Anyway, you're adding in premises that I want to avoid. Perhaps it would help if you assumed a deistic model?

First of all, if God exists, why does he wish to hide from us?

That's quite an assumption.

There is strong evidence that if God exists, he does not wish us to worship him or believe in him.

I agree, which is why I'm trying to avoid such premises.

He has gone to great work to make it look like he doesn't exist.

Like what?

[angeleyes]

Originally Posted by Storm2008

Something I hear frequently from non-believers is that they would believe in God if there were any evidence. I have two issues with this statement.

1) There is some - admittedly very weak - evidence: the widespread reports of personal experiences with God. Now, I can see why this is unconvincing, but it is evidence. Weak, yes, but evidence nonetheless, which is more than can be said for the argument that there is no God. With that nit picked....

We could also say that this is the strongest kind of evidence, because when it has the element of personal experience, it's more meaningful and harder to deny. We also have to recognize that even "objective" evidence is often interpreted subjectively.

2) What evidence of God's existence could there be? You say that evidence would convince you, but what would qualify?

Personal experience....

[Asimov]

Define God.

Originally Posted by Storm2008

1) There is some - admittedly very weak - evidence: the widespread reports of personal experiences with God. Now, I can see why this is unconvincing, but it is evidence. Weak, yes, but evidence nonetheless, which is more than can be said for the argument that there is no God. With that nit picked....

Why is that evidence?

2) What evidence of God's existence could there be? You say that evidence would convince you, but what would qualify?

Empirical.

[Storm2008]

Originally Posted by Asimov

Define God.

For purposes of this thread, I guess the deistic model would be most productive.

Why is that evidence?

With all the qualifiers of the OP in mind, why wouldn't it be?

Empirical.

Like what?