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Old 31st December 2005, 12:25 AM
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Tao Te Ching -Chapter 1

Quote:
Chapter 1


The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the beginning of heaven and earth.
The named is the mother of ten thousand things.
Ever desireless, one can see the mystery.
Ever desiring, one can see the manifestations.
These two spring from the same source but differ in name;
this appears as darkness.
Darkness within darkness.
The gate to all mystery.

Does The Tao write itself on a clean slate?
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Old 31st December 2005, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightkeeper
Does The Tao write itself on a clean slate?
The Tao writes nothing. This passage is number one because it allows us to better understand the nature of Tao in respect to how we will understand the rest of the book. If we first understand that:

1. The Tao that is discussed is not the Eternal Tao. and...

2. The Tao is beyond words.

Then we can proceed to learn from the Tao Te Ching as Lao Tzu intends.

The concept of I Ching has been in chinese culture for hundreds, if not thousands of years before Lao Tzu or Confucious were born. Lao Tzu confronts I Ching in a way that no one before him has. He confronts it passively. He confesses his understanding of "not understanding" first and foremost. This is key to understanding what being a Taoist, and what the Tao Te Ching discusses.

He then goes into discussing Tao in ways we can understand. In analogies.

In my translation states:

"As the origin of heaven and earth, it is nameless.
As "the mother" of all things, it is nameable."

This is important. Because we may not understand the unknown workings of Chi and Tao. But we can understand the known workings of nature. And this is seen as "the nameable."

So we proceed forth into the book with that understanding.
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Old 31st December 2005, 06:03 AM
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i got a question

i got the tao te ching by ralph alan dale and it words it diffrently is that a bad thing? im just wondering about this translation
it goes like this:
(the tao that can be told is not the universal tao
the tao that can be named is not the universal name
in the infancy of the universe their were no names
naming fragments the mysteries of life into ten thousand things and their manefestations
yet mysteries and manefestations spring from the same source
the great integrity
winch is mysterie within manefestation
the manefestation within the mystery
the naming of the unamed and the unnaming of the named
when these interpretaions are in full attendance we pass threw the gates of innaming notions and in our journey of trancendence.)

this seems worded diffrently.
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Old 31st December 2005, 06:12 AM
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I think both translations say the same thing.

MV, let's talk about unnaming the named with some examples.
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Old 31st December 2005, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by willybilly30
this seems worded diffrently.
It does. I can see the similarities, however I think the translation was stretched a bit. I think it made the already complicated simplicity of Taoism more complicated. Did that make sense? HAHA
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Old 31st December 2005, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
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MV, let's talk about unnaming the named with some examples.
Well, we will see many in the future chapters of the Tao Te Ching. Such as understanding the nature of emptiness, the ocean, kings, etc... Let us not get too ahead of ourselves. We are but starting to climb the tree. We can see the top branch, but if we try to grab it we will fail. But there is one right in front of us. Let us grab that one first.
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Old 31st December 2005, 06:31 AM
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is that ok? or should i look for another translation. how come this ones worded diffrently that makes me worry the authors adding his own thoughts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Vigil
It does. I can see the similarities, however I think the translation was stretched a bit. I think it made the already complicated simplicity of Taoism more complicated. Did that make sense? HAHA
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Old 31st December 2005, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by willybilly30
is that ok? or should i look for another translation. how come this ones worded diffrently that makes me worry the authors adding his own thoughts.
You will have that with any translation. I personally own 4 translations. Or, I used to. I can't seem to find the other 3 right now.
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Old 31st December 2005, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Vigil
Well, we will see many in the future chapters of the Tao Te Ching. Such as understanding the nature of emptiness, the ocean, kings, etc... Let us not get too ahead of ourselves. We are but starting to climb the tree. We can see the top branch, but if we try to grab it we will fail. But there is one right in front of us. Let us grab that one first.
The student asks when the student is ready to hear the answer. It's a logical question from the information presented.

In these studies there is no one teacher. We all teach each other. It wouldn't be good to hold anyone back.
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Old 31st December 2005, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightkeeper
The student asks when the student is ready to hear the answer. It's a logical question from the information presented.

In these studies there is no one teacher. We all teach each other. It wouldn't be good to hold anyone back.
But the point of the book is "unnaming the named." Let us allow the book to do it's job.
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